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Nightingales: Blood Prey (PTSD Discussion ONLY)


JDW
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I'm glad to see that this subject did get it's own thread. I hesitated to post my opinion before for the sole reason of compromising the integrity of its source material (we haven't seen the house yet). The following is obviously my own perspective; this isn't like the National Consensus, I'm not representing the entire single, female, early 20s, Caucasian, civilian demographic. I'm registered No Party Affiliation. I have no friends or close relatives who are active duty servicemen or servicewomen (none that I've been comfortable enough to talk about this sort of thing with, at least). I am a devil's advocate. So with that out of the way...

I think that a better system NEEDS to be developed in order to make EVERY guest's awareness of event content more lucid and thorough. As of right now, this concept is practically nonexistent.

Example: I just did some role playing. I pretended that I have a special need which currently dictates specific things that I should and should not do to maintain a healthy and active life style (insert heart disease, pregnancy, PTSD, schizophrenia, epilepsy, high blood pressure, dependency on a service animal, wheel chair, or other device for locomotion or navigation, etc.). I go on to Halloween Horror Night's website for information. On the home page, there is a warning at the bottom of the screen that only mentions that this event is not intended for children under the age of 13. I click on it to see if it will take me to more information. Nothing happens. 15 minutes later, I finally locate the Frequently Asked Questions section of the site, which you actually have to click on the word Tickets to get to. When I hover over Tickets, it is not included in the automatic drop down menu. If you're somehow intuitive enough click on Tickets, it is the very last menu point on the right hand side of the screen. I then read through each of the 15 questions listed. Not one of them mentions health concerns. Furthermore, Guest Services is not even mentioned anywhere on the page. No phone number, no contact information, nothing. I've now spent 20 minutes trying to answer a simple question: Should I risk buying an expensive ticket for something that could potentially cause harm to me in any way, shape, or form? What about the cost of travel? You can see where I'm going with this. This situation turns from a thrilling experience into a disappointing money sink in the blink of an eye. I personally don't feel it's fair that people have to wait until they're inside the park to find out just how many of the eight houses are going to accommodate their special need. I also don't think it's fair that I now have to do another Google search for Universal Orlando's Guest Service's phone number, which does come up on the first try thankfully. The website is completely absent of acts of inclusion. It does not foster a sense of security or concern for this element of diversity.

This is my suggestion to improve the situation. In order to avoid unnecessarily releasing private or disclosed information to the public, simply set up a chain reaction for those who need more information:

1. Put Guest Service's phone number on the event's website.

2. Compile a conscious protocol manual every year detailing information on each house, scare zone, and show regarding both physical characteristics and thematic content and how either could hinder an individual's well being. Now, obviously this needs to be quick, to the point, and logical. It doesn't have to be this cumbersome thing, but simply a quick reference to answer a person's question via phone call. Example: "Does xyz house have strobes?" If they have a very specific concern, such as, "I have an electric wheelchair that is larger than the standard size. What is your required Fire Code clearance? I'm concerned that my chair may not easily fit around some of the corners in your houses," then we move on to the next step.

3. Offer PRE-SCHEDULED tours of any concerning areas. Every event night, from 5:45-6:30, escort guests who have requested this service in advance, voluntarily provided applicable documentation or evidence if necessary, and have already purchased their ticket to inspect whatever area is concerning them. Let me be clear, I am not saying that you should let a person with epilepsy walk through a fully operational Dead Exposure alone. Nor am I saying that the Vietnam medic should go though a fully operational Nightingales by himself. These are obviously sensitive matters that require delicate handling. Let the medic walk through the house with the lights on, play the sounds separately while he listens backstage, etc. If Universal took the time to make me feel like my needs genuinely mattered, then I'm going to be far less disappointing that I can't go into a house; whereas, if I take the gamble, buy my ticket, then show up and discover that I can't do half the attractions, I'm going to be pretty pissed off in plain English.

No additional people would need to be hired in order to implement this system. I know this is the day and age of being required to go above and beyond your job description, but this is something that could be easily incorporated into people's intimidate responsibilities with HHN. The more people you get involved, the lighter the workload is for everyone. How hard would it be to say to someone, "By the way, you're already working with this specific subject, would you mind shooting me a quick bullet point email of things you suggest we look out for?"

Anyway, I have a great deal of respect for our serviceman and woman, and I'm all for diversity. It's not my place to make analogies or pass personal judgement on whether or not this PTSD discussion is a valid argument. All I know is that right now there's NO acts of inclusion pertaining to the guests who attend HHN, and I hope that something serious can be done about that in the near future before a situation does occur that everyone regrets. Preventative maintenance wins over damage control every time.

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If we're intelligent enough to have this dialog, and in some cases...I'm surprised we are, then I'm sure Universal had the same dialog and took things into consideration.

That's kind of my line of thinking. I think they knew what they were getting themselves into. Theme parks are notorious for their fun-sucking legal teams!

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That's kind of my line of thinking. I think they knew what they were getting themselves into. Theme parks are notorious for their fun-sucking legal teams!

Exactly! Knowing how events like these can be liability nightmares without the proper precautions, Universal would be naive not to think outside the box regarding houses like these and any potential issues that may occur. Regardless of how many cautionary directives are provided, there is always a chance of something happening that wasn't planned for or expected. But I would like to think that in the big scheme of things, Uni has a good grasp on any problematic situations that could occur.

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First, I would like to point out that service members are not a "minority". Secondly, like Hush has mentioned, war theme is not something that really should be used as a haunted house. Third, like Legacy has mentioned, we are talking about a disorder that goes undiagnosed frequently.

IMO, I think it is wrong to be concerned about a house being scaled back because you don't want the house to be lame. We are talking about images that service members have seen in REAL LIFE represented in a scenario that could trigger those memories again. A&D mentioned in the tweetup that there are trenches which would make this PSTD discussion relevant. If the trenches portray an actual firefight/casulties, then poor taste Uni... but if the trench scene is Nightingales devouring fallen soldiers then that is a step away from the "war scene". WothLD was not a confined space like a house. We see gruesome scenes is houses that are NOT war related. We could have had a disaster themed house with Nightingales instead of a war themed house. War hospitals are just as sad as the battlefield.

I agree with the posts that Uni hopefully has used better judgement and I am sure their legal team has been all over this issue. Signs are not enough... Pumpkin is right...more needs to be done about the warnings.

I would not want to even wade into the waters about having a war house... More people die from war than murders, fires, or other themes that are portrayed in haunted houses. The sz last year did not depict casualties, I hope the only casualties are Nightingale victims.

Sorry to rant..but I feel that maybe we have lost sight of the horrors that war bring and I would not want to cause a veteran any more trauma or pain than they have already endured. Yes Veterans can avoid the house but is that really right? I spend my money to attend the event but I can not fully participate in it? Universal should not want to alienate any part of their audience no matter the size.

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Long post is long

Longer post is longer!

These two posts, imo, are the most well thought out and reasonable posts in the thread. I agree wholeheartedly, and you both take the whole situation into consideration. In addition, the mention of Uni's soul-sucking legal team also brings perspective to the whole situation...hell, it took how many years to even have Cindy in a house? And that's not nearly as big of a deal as something like this *could* be.

If we're intelligent enough to have this dialog, and in some cases...I'm surprised we are, then I'm sure Universal had the same dialog and took things into consideration.

My sentiments exactly. I'm happy that this dialog has maintained its level of composure and hasn't devolved into mindless bickering (though there is some bickering, of course) but on that very note, Uni HAD to have had some discussion about it first...they didn't just tell the team "Hey guys, we're making a totally realistic war house" and they said "ok." I'm sure they had the exact same concerns. BUT, that goes without saying, these ARE legitimate concerns....as they are for any house or condition, as Pumpkin brings up. I think if they've gotten this far with so little issue, they probably have a good handle on things, and I think that this house will turn out great and won't offend any more than any other house offends.

On that note, this is definitely my most looked forward to house this year. The concept and the theme just totally blow me away. Especially since I'm a nursing student and I just had to learn about Florence Nightingale and everything (though WWI is a bit after the time she was a field nurse). On a funny note, some of the nursing instructors would probably be offended that the demons are called "Nightingales" because Florence Nightingale is still very highly regarded in nursing culture. She was the "Lady with the Lamp" and all of the instructors here wear a lamp, and giddily explain that during graduation we'll walk with a lamp to get our diploma or something like that.

My point is: any idea can offend anybody. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be looked into: It just means that Uni probably already has a decent handle on what to do if it's too out of hand. I'm glad that this point came up, because it is a very valid point, and I think that Pumpkin hits it on the nose: Uni should have a bit more warning on the websites and everything for people with any sort of disorder or potential disorder. They shouldn't have to make a big change or go completely out of their way; just a bit more visibility for the disclaimer, or more information in their disclaimer that's on the front page would probably suffice.

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Snipped

You make a valid point which was already spoken about...in my opinion, trench warfare is nothing like modern warfare. I don't think that they'll even represent trench combat while in the house...if the Nightingales are nurses, then the soldiers all will already be wounded. There should be no fighting between soldiers...if there is any gunfire or fighting in the trenches, it'd be against the Nightingales and not against "enemy soldiers" or the guests.

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at the tweetup, A&D mentioned that they put in trenches with a twist, but from what in sounds like, they're focusing very predominently on the nightinglaes rather than the war aspect. it'll still be placed in ww1 during a battle, and they said you'll go through trenches and tents and other things, but i think there won't be many soldiers running at you with guns or anything. probably the sound effects, but my thought is that they want to promote the nightingales more than anything in that house so they can make them known, loved and sequel material to be put in other disasters.

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Guest kiwisoup

First, I would like to point out that service members are not a "minority". Secondly, like Hush has mentioned, war theme is not something that really should be used as a haunted house. Third, like Legacy has mentioned, we are talking about a disorder that goes undiagnosed frequently.

How are service members not a minority? Half of a percent of the population is currently enlisted, 9% if you include veterans. If something is not the majority of people it is the minority. I think you are thinking the word "minority" is a dirty word or something maybe because of racial bias or something along those lines, but that's not what we are talking about here.

Secondly, The event starts in less than a week and there's nothing that can be done or is going to change by continuing to discuss and rant and worry about it. Everybody is just saying the exact same thing over and over and over going in circles and it's totally redundant.

Universal is not stupid. They were sensitive to people around 9/11 and completely changed an entire year because of child abductions and potential sensitivity due to those then-current events. Also, as I recall Universal removed references to Germany and Nazis in the War of the Living Dead scarezone after the first press release. Obviously they are focusing on the banshee/nurse/hospital theme above the war theme, and as I've said in the previously, the Nightingales are the aggressors NOT soldiers.

Edited by kiwisoup
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After Employee Preview last night, this is my opinion: if I had a serviceman or woman that I was close to, and they asked me for my honest opinion as a civilian, I would suggest that they not risk going in this house. For me it felt very, very real, and I have no realistic way of imagining what war actually feels like for a soldier.

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After Employee Preview last night, this is my opinion: if I had a serviceman or woman that I was close to, and they asked me for my honest opinion as a civilian, I would suggest that they not risk going in this house. For me it felt very, very real, and I have no realistic way of imagining what war actually feels like for a soldier.

Yep...

Edited by Legacy
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face palm. FACE PALM FACE PALM FACE PALM.

Keep hitting yourself you're going to get a bruise.

I had been asked by other service members for my opinion, and I gave it. You can argue it and get frustrated all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that telling service members and veterans who want to attend the event, "just don't go," isn't fair. They have every right to attend, but also deserve an honest opinion from a peer on the house. I gave it. If you disagree, whatever. Just please don't assume "what's best," for veterans or PTSD sufferers. If you read (really read) my official opinion on, I explain that it will depend on the individual.

I'm not out against this house. While I'll admit I'm not a fan of "war" anything (as I've stated), I do think they CAN WORK. Nothing in my statement requests or suggests change. I trust that Universal is smart enough to do that on their own (and I've heard they were even doing so as the night progressed). I'm not out to destroy the house, just trying to make it better for guests who actually want to attend.

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After going through the house last night, I feel like all of the worries about PTSD for this house were unnecessary. I honestly feel like there would be more of an issue when walking through The Thing than Nightingales.

The Thing has two scenes where very loud gun effects are used. In one scene, a lady points a handgun directly at guests with a loud gunshot e prompt. Nightingales does have a room near the end with a machine gun, but other than that, it wasn't nearly as "warlike" as I expected.

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Just to clarify as well, I very much enjoyed going through this house last night. It's the one I most anticipated, and I'll definitely be going back through it every chance I get. I don't want anything in the house to be changed in the slightest, but I do wish that people's attitudes would improve regarding this specific concern. It does create a very immersive environment that is not as theatrical as I would have imagined, and I'm not talking about the Nightingales when I say this. They're obviously fictional, and guest perception has been crafted by Universal to feel exactly that way: not real. I'm talking about the actual trenches and setting, the sound effects, etc. I made my previous statement as a courtesy in a hypothetical situation. As cerebral as that is, I stand by it. It felt believable to me. Some parts more than others (won't get into it until the event opens), but overall it was enough for my after impression to be, "That felt very real."

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WWI trench warfare is not the same as modern day. I don't see the relevance of this at all. Other than the noises the setting should not affect anyone. Unless they are very sensitive and then any one of the houses could be an issue.

Someone with PTSD is very likely to be set off by gunshots or someone pointing a gun at them. I'll reserve an opinion until I go through the house but as I've said before I understand why members of our armed forces with PTSD would or could be set off by this house.

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Keep hitting yourself you're going to get a bruise.

I had been asked by other service members for my opinion, and I gave it. You can argue it and get frustrated all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that telling service members and veterans who want to attend the event, "just don't go," isn't fair. They have every right to attend, but also deserve an honest opinion from a peer on the house. I gave it. If you disagree, whatever. Just please don't assume "what's best," for veterans or PTSD sufferers. If you read (really read) my official opinion on, I explain that it will depend on the individual.

I'm not out against this house. While I'll admit I'm not a fan of "war" anything (as I've stated), I do think they CAN WORK. Nothing in my statement requests or suggests change. I trust that Universal is smart enough to do that on their own (and I've heard they were even doing so as the night progressed). I'm not out to destroy the house, just trying to make it better for guests who actually want to attend.

well they can totally go to the event, but maybe they should avoid this house all together, problem solved i think :mellow:

I mean, is only this one house that is causing this problem, not the entire event, i know seems super unfair but, if like you said the safety or the scareactors is at risk then, i dont know... they are just doing their job after all, of course drunks and a-holes always mess with the scareactors, but this seems a little more problematic

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well they can totally go to the event, but maybe they should avoid this house all together, problem solved i think :mellow:

I mean, is only this one house that is causing this problem, not the entire event, i know seems super unfair but, if like you said the safety or the scareactors is at risk then, i dont know... they are just doing their job after all, of course drunks and a-holes always mess with the scareactors, but this seems a little more problematic

Yea to me just skip that one house and your fine. Problem solved.

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After walking through this house I can easily see how the nature of this house MAY send some over the edge. While I've never been in combat, it seemed more than real enough for me. While the main focus is on the nightingales (there is one soldier that fires a machine gun across our path, but I'm pretty sure he was trying to get rid of a nightingale on the opposite side of the line), the constant sound of gunfire and screams combined with the realistic trench setting is enough to (I imagine) potentially trigger some memories or such. So...yah, y'all have been warned. (great house though)

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After walking through this house I can easily see how the nature of this house MAY send some over the edge. While I've never been in combat, it seemed more than real enough for me. While the main focus is on the nightingales (there is one soldier that fires a machine gun across our path, but I'm pretty sure he was trying to get rid of a nightingale on the opposite side of the line), the constant sound of gunfire and screams combined with the realistic trench setting is enough to (I imagine) potentially trigger some memories or such. So...yah, y'all have been warned. (great house though)

oh yeah, now that i know

this house is going to F :blink: k someone up, there are a lot of little things that might F'ed someone up, like explosions or is little subtle things, like explosions or gun fire, or the corpses, most people might handle it but, there might be the one person that might not be able to, just one person that might freak, but one person might end up in a broken jaw

I still love that house, so much

Edited by black mask
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  • 8 months later...

My soon to be father in law went and he was a Vietnam vet, He did get jumpy as hell, and I know he was never in actual WW2 trenches but he was in a war. He said he knew it was fake and that he was safe, its just his reactionary instincts started to take hold with regards to fight or flight response. He enjoyed it very much, he said that the creepiest thing to him was that the banshees actually gave that feeling of horrifying anticipation of something bad is gonna happen. In his opinion he said that most vets should be able to handle the house without any major issues, but he did say that if someone was REALLY SEVERELY affected by PTSD that they probably would not choose to go through. This is coming from a man that has trouble eating in a vietnamese restaurant because hes looking over his shoulder all night, he said and I quote " I love the food, but these ******* (expletive) make me nervous. Just sharing, make of it what you will.

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  • Mark M. changed the title to Nightingales: Blood Prey (PTSD Discussion ONLY)
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