Why Zombies?

[JDW]

With TWD coming back a second year to HHN, the show still going strong, and this zombie culture lately... I have to wonder. Why do people find zombies scary? Specifically the lumbering, dead, Romero version in The Walking Dead. They can't out think you and they can't outrun you. It's like being afraid of very dumb Galapagos tortoises. You have to be a complete klutz, totally oblivious of your surroundings, or somehow plop yourself down right in a crowd if them.

If that isn't bad enough, their existence defies logic.They would rot away, explode in the heat, freeze and eviscerate all of their cells, have predators and hunters pick them off, and damage their own limbs in such a ridiculously short time they would pose no threat at all within a few weeks tops.

My autistic brain cannot justify their existence and therefore they are not scary in the least. They are not like other monsters that, in their world, work. They invalidate their own existence in their own universe.

Have you ever wondered why a Romero style movie never shows the "war" it's because it couldn't happen. They are slow, useless, and could not take over a town let alone the world.

So... all that in mind, I'm downright flabbergasted at why they are popular or even scary in the least. I really am genuinely curious why people are:

A.) Interested in them and

B.) Actually scared of them

[King_K.]

The thing that scares me the most is the virus that zombies carry.

This virus can easily be spread from one person to another simply through bodily fluids. So whether the zombie actually bites you or not, if you get some spray back from their fluids into a scrape, nose, cut, mouth, etc., you can be turned into a zombie. The majority of humans fear death. We would no longer be ourselves when the zombie virus takes over, even though we'd still be walking about and eating flesh, we would no longer be human.

It’s the horror of the natural life processes being so- violated. If the dead start getting up and eating the living, it’s a complete reversal of the natural way of things. Their existence might defy logic, but that's why we're given an imagination.

[ferox]

Along with that King said about body horror and the fear of death...

Putting candy inside of a piece of paper isn't hard. Killing a zombie isn't hard. However, due to the nature of the virus spreading rapidly and the often sheer amounts of zombies you end up like Lucy. You get overwhelmed. You run out of bullets. You get exhausted from mowing them down. You can only do so much. There's the pressure. The pressure. The pressure. You make one mistake and...well now you are being eaten alive. You are staring your death in the face as death stares you in the face.

Zombies also only exist in areas of unrest. They carry the unspoken vibe of social decay, while representing the decay of the human body.

Edited July 27, 2013 by ferox

[JunoSynth]

I've asked myself this same question but for other types of monsters/creatures. The creature from Alien scares me more then anything else. Zombies are on the last of my list. I think it just depends how immersed/partial to the particular creature/story one is. It makes sense since Alien is my favorite horror movie. Leave to Cleaver was really the only scary house I can think of but I realized it was because I was so fond of the story.

[JDW]

Good points everyone.

I get the the fear of viruses (I'm a bit of a clean freak) and the fear of death. I also get the social decay aspect, the allusions to consumerism, and the dumbing down of society. But I don't see how it translates to zombies... especially the ones in TWD. I know everyone has irrational fears. I'm so afraid of sharks I would break out in a cold sweat on the Jaws ride. But Sharks are very real and very dangerous. They also are quick, silent, and vicious.

Zombies are the opposite in every aspect with their moaning, shambling, and awkward swings. Its also one thing for a few people to fear them... But to be such a big phenomenon? I don't get it. OK the show isn't really about being scary. Which in itself perplexes me at a horror event. "28 days", "The crazies", "The last of us", or any thing using the fast zombies makes so much more sense. To me it perfects all the fears the Romero zombies should instill. They are alive but insane, fast, angry, violent.... aka scary and unpredictable.

What's funny is I feel like they try to make the zombies scary in the Walking Dead and, at least to me, it just ends up comical. They always have to hobble, tie up, of catch the character off guard because they know there is nothing scary. Heck Michonne kick zombie butt tied to a post. Also, in the recent game, there was a part where you get to a Motel and have to do.... something... lol I forget honestly. But they are all sneaking around and if the zombies sees you they kill you... its absurd. I kept screaming for the game to give me a baseball bat and free control of the game.

[ferox]

Zombies have to be slow. Or at least not fast. They are symbols of death! You avoid for a while and then it creeps up on you. You fight it off for a while...but it consumes you.

[LV-426]

I think part of it is the gross out factor. Zombies are not just zombies but they are disgusting rotting humans walking around.

Seeing them in on itself is scary for a lot of people.

Some of the zombie make up is pretty horrible to look at (plus they are gory, some of the zombies look really really gross)

Sometimes I see the walkers in Walking Dead, and it makes me think "What if I saw that thing in my back yard" And if I saw a rotting walking thing with half it's face missing, yeah It would be pretty scary to see.

Zombies also eat you. Other monsters just kill you or haunt you. But these things will actually bite and chew on your flesh. They get too close for confort and invade your personal space. You are seeing something that used to be a person now trying to eat you. That is kind of freaky.

Another thing about them is that they are pretty hard to kill, and they are many. they just keep coming and coming and they don't feel pain. it can make people feel nervous because they cannot be stopped and they cannot be taken down.

Things that eat you in real life are pretty scary as it is. So I guess Zombies are like the worst predator that human beings have on the movies and shows if you think about it.

Edited July 27, 2013 by LV-426

[JDW]

Vampires drink your blood, Werewolves eviscerate and eat you, Heck Jaws eats you.

In movies most monsters want to do harm or consume some part of you. And I'm not saying all zombies are not scary, just the shamblers or "walkers". I understand the fear of a slow and unstoppable force. (Jason, Mike Meyers, etc.)but zombies are easily stoppable and they have huge drawbacks. They have no coordination, the have no real skill, they are pretty much the worst predator there could be.

I do see how people's aversion to corpses is horrifying in that aspect. But otherwise they pose little to no real threat. Michonne proves that in and of herself. Sure she is a talented swordsman. But it aint like you are going up against seasoned warriors. You fighting something that can barely walk and cannot do any real thinking. Replace them with old people on walkers and... not only does it become really offensive, but it suddenly is extremely laughable... and the elderly can think! The appearance doesn't make them any more dangerous.

OK so putting myself in the shoes of the TWD characters (Granted I have no idea how the infection started or could have possibly become an pandemic)the first time I see one zombie, sure I'm shocked and in disbelief. But so long as my fear doesn't over take me I pick up literally anything heavy/sharp/blunt with a long reach and I start whacking them. I don't end up in a "surrounded on all sides scenario" bc I don't put myself in one. By the second or third kill you're pretty much in your groove. They are very slow so you take you time picking them off staying out of reach. They are not strong and they aren't smart so you find a place they can't reach and go out when you need. I mean a chain link fence keeps them out.

But again arguing the point that a city full of zombies could even happen is an extreme stretch.

Make them fast, vicious, angry, semi-intelligent, semi-dexterous and you got a much more formidable opponent especially in large numbers. But TWD is the absolute worst type (or best type depending on how you look at it) of zombie.

I guess I'm alone in this. Other than for mild entertainment or comic relief I just have never seen the interest in/fear of TWD zombiewise. Now drama wise. Sure it's a good show. But zombies everywhere going into the 4th season is like nails on a chalk board to me. (not to mention mowed yards and 2013 cars). The zombies should all but be gone at this point and it should just deal with the people that are left. On a rare case have one or two show up as situation dictates. But it sounds like they are going to make the zombies smart and more of a threat this time around. Argh.

The show isn't going away and I guarantee you, unless popularity wanes, it's here to stay at the event.

Anyway is there anyone who feels where I'm coming from on this? Or anyone who truly is afraid of them and not waxing philosophical?

[ferox]

I don't end up in a "surrounded on all sides scenario" bc I don't put myself in one.

You don't get to decide what situation you are in all the time, do you? What if the situation that you thought was safe suddenly gets overrun by zombies? Sure you can take down one or two, but eventually you're going to be overwhelmed. It's also kinda silly to assume that you wouldn't face any mental stress while facing down death in a couple of senses.

Edited July 28, 2013 by ferox

[LV-426]

Vampires drink your blood, Werewolves eviscerate and eat you, Heck Jaws eats you.

In movies most monsters want to do harm or consume some part of you. And I'm not saying all zombies are not scary, just the shamblers or "walkers". I understand the fear of a slow and unstoppable force. (Jason, Mike Meyers, etc.)but zombies are easily stoppable and they have huge drawbacks. They have no coordination, the have no real skill, they are pretty much the worst predator there could be.

I do see how people's aversion to corpses is horrifying in that aspect. But otherwise they pose little to no real threat. Michonne proves that in and of herself. Sure she is a talented swordsman. But it aint like you are going up against seasoned warriors. You fighting something that can barely walk and cannot do any real thinking. Replace them with old people on walkers and... not only does it become really offensive, but it suddenly is extremely laughable... and the elderly can think! The appearance doesn't make them any more dangerous.

OK so putting myself in the shoes of the TWD characters (Granted I have no idea how the infection started or could have possibly become an pandemic)the first time I see one zombie, sure I'm shocked and in disbelief. But so long as my fear doesn't over take me I pick up literally anything heavy/sharp/blunt with a long reach and I start whacking them. I don't end up in a "surrounded on all sides scenario" bc I don't put myself in one. By the second or third kill you're pretty much in your groove. They are very slow so you take you time picking them off staying out of reach. They are not strong and they aren't smart so you find a place they can't reach and go out when you need. I mean a chain link fence keeps them out.

But again arguing the point that a city full of zombies could even happen is an extreme stretch.

Make them fast, vicious, angry, semi-intelligent, semi-dexterous and you got a much more formidable opponent especially in large numbers. But TWD is the absolute worst type (or best type depending on how you look at it) of zombie.

I guess I'm alone in this. Other than for mild entertainment or comic relief I just have never seen the interest in/fear of TWD zombiewise. Now drama wise. Sure it's a good show. But zombies everywhere going into the 4th season is like nails on a chalk board to me. (not to mention mowed yards and 2013 cars). The zombies should all but be gone at this point and it should just deal with the people that are left. On a rare case have one or two show up as situation dictates. But it sounds like they are going to make the zombies smart and more of a threat this time around. Argh.

The show isn't going away and I guarantee you, unless popularity wanes, it's here to stay at the event.

Anyway is there anyone who feels where I'm coming from on this? Or anyone who truly is afraid of them and not waxing philosophical?

I can see exactly where you are coming from, I do.

But I can see why people like them so much. They don't make a lot of sense and I have actually seen articles about how unlikely the zombie apocalypse would be (I read some on Cracked.com)

I understand how stupid the idea of slow zombies is if you do think about it.

I don't know. I like them but they are not my favorite monster. I like the show and I like zombie movies in general. If I do think about it, it is pretty weird.

I cannot really answer why I like them but I do like them. Like I said a zombie is a lot more gruesome to see than a vampire or werewolf.

but, I am not really sure Why i like zombie movies as much. I guess I am going to have to think about it lol.

[JDW]

Been rewatching the show in preperation. One big thing I noticed that absiolutely made no sense.

When the Govonor and Milton are discussing Michonne's zombies. They actually says because they have no jaw they are starving to death... But much slower than we would... Um WHAT!?!

That would imply they have a metabolism or could die after being... ya know... dead.

The hearts don't beat... The blood doesn't flow... they don't need to eat as they can't digest food. Heck Michonne says that penny "doesn't have needs". Sure Milton seems to have strange ideas about zombies BUT Michonne's zombies do look emaciated so its almost like the show is validating Milton's claims. ARGH logically this show MAKES NO SENSE! and the creature it is based on openly defies the natural order and the laws of thermodynamics.

But then again:

[JDW]

Here is an interesting take on it and it delves into more along the lines of what I was thinking.

http://youtu.be/RSoIDJCY3r8

[LV-426]

Been rewatching the show in preperation. One big thing I noticed that absiolutely made no sense.

When the Govonor and Milton are discussing Michonne's zombies. They actually says because they have no jaw they are starving to death... But much slower than we would... Um WHAT!?!

That would imply they have a metabolism or could die after being... ya know... dead.

The hearts don't beat... The blood doesn't flow... they don't need to eat as they can't digest food. Heck Michonne says that penny "doesn't have needs". Sure Milton seems to have strange ideas about zombies BUT Michonne's zombies do look emaciated so its almost like the show is validating Milton's claims. ARGH logically this show MAKES NO SENSE! and the creature it is based on openly defies the natural order and the laws of thermodynamics.

But then again:

http://youtu.be/oqZMzmPBMqc

[Cinderelly115]

I've never understood the fear of Zombies some people have. I personally think it is silly. My ex-boss was terrified of them and used to sit in his office and make plans for what he would do if a Zombie Apocalypse happened and this was before Walking Dead.

[bubby45]

Its the fear of being eaten alive. This is why people fear zombies the most. For some it is the fear of the dead.

[LV-426]

I've never understood the fear of Zombies some people have. I personally think it is silly. My ex-boss was terrified of them and used to sit in his office and make plans for what he would do if a Zombie Apocalypse happened and this was before Walking Dead.

maybe he was scared of zombies because they are disgusting looking? seriously they are rotting corpses that are walking around trying to bite you with their rooting teeth...

Whats NOT scary about that? I can understand that zombie movies are not scary. You are not going to have nightmares from watching a zombie movie.

But zombies are pretty grotesque looking. I don't see what is silly about being afraid of a walking corpse. They are pretty disgusting to look at.

[ferox]

How does Freddy kill people in dreams? Dreams aren't actually a place you "go to" in any sense so he wouldn't be able to enter your dreams nor would his attacks cause you any physical harm. I don't get it! If I was in that situation I would just lucid dream I mean you saw it happen in part four it can be done I don't get it.

It is a work of fiction. Meaning that one or more elements of the real world may not apply. That's why fiction exists. Horror is often out there.

Edited August 5, 2013 by ferox

[JDW]

How does Freddy kill people in dreams? Dreams aren't actually a place you "go to" in any sense so he wouldn't be able to enter your dreams nor would his attacks cause you any physical harm. I don't get it! If I was in that situation I would just lucid dream I mean you saw it happen in part four it can be done I don't get it.

It is a work of fiction. Meaning that one or more elements of the real world may not apply. That's why fiction exists. Horror is often out there.

Dreams are in your mind. There is plenty of mythology surrounding dreams. They are aslo largely unmeasurable. Demons, Dreams, the spiritual plane, etc. There is enough about dreams, at least in my thought of them, that is unkown to make it a wash in logic. But also NOES never makes claims to be scientifically based.

TWD throws pseudo-science in there and sets the bar to be scrutinized by the scientific method. I don't expect things to hold up to the real world in everything. but I at least expect them to make sense in their own universe. If their is some Deus Ex Machina that would wrap it all up into a happy little bow based on their world so be it... But I have yet to see one. Also,unless you are going pure fantasy that has no real basis in reality, their needs to be some anchor... Some plausible root that can allow you to suspend your disbelief. But, from the spread of the virus to the actual zombies, I find nothing about TWD plausible or explained. Rick goes into a coma... and then wakes up to an entire world of zombies with no explination what so ever. The zombies rot but don't rot away. They eat but don't need to... but they do... but they don't. They are dead... but do things only live tissue can do. Too many contradictions. So many that i have a hard time with the story. It's a good story about people... that gets interrupted by this Zed nonsense from time to time.

Think about this. When a zombie eats, where does it go? If they are truly dead (which decomp, lack of heart beat and respiration confirm) that food would just sit in the stomach rotting. This would cause methane and other very volatile compounds to build up in the hot Georgia sun (forget that a human body in itself does this sans food in a few short days). They would bloat and explode. Otherwise, if they are alive, they would not rot and they would have to expel waste. This also does not happen. A fungus/virus could somewhat control a living mind but to maintin dead cells is impossible for any length of time.

Again, if they wanted to cheap out and say aliens, magic, or evil spirits... i guess I would sort of shake my head and wash my hands of it. But the fact that they try and have a foot in both words grates on my sense of logic.

[Loki]

I've always watched Zombie movies because I find them funny. Bad things happening to people invariably doing dumb things.

After all, in the Zombie Apocalypse it is essential for everyone to split up and walk alone in the dark without looking around all that well.

[ferox]

Characters in TWD attempting to explain the unexplained doesn't mean that they are expecting it to stand up to the scientific method on Earth. If they had the same laws of science, that element wouldn't be fictional. Having scenes in the movie where people try to understand what they don't know doesn't mean that it's being suggested to be scientifically sound. If it was scientifically sound, it would be another genre of horror. The uknown (why the world fell victim to the Wa1lker virus) is a very common thing in horror. All horror that has a supernatural element to it has that world being 100% accurate within the rules of that world, no matter how fantastic. And all of that horror has a grounding in reality. TWD is using a very basic trope, which is a virus that alters the nature of the human body in some horrifying way. Honest question...do you just not watch horror movies very often? These are pretty basic concepts.

[JDW]

Honest question...do you just not watch horror movies very often? These are pretty basic concepts.

Nice scarcastic jab there you seem to like to disagree with any opinion i have on anything so this discussion may be moot. Some chip on your should for me bc I'm unhappy with TWD?

Regardless I watch/have watched a ton of movies. I've seen all the classics, many obscure horror films, and a ton not worth watching bc they are poorly thought out. I'm 36 and have seen nearly 4000 movies in my life. In the Zombie genre I've seen at least 50 movies. I find most of them a waste of time.

I know what tropes are. I know the basis for which they do zombie movies. But just becaue it's been accepted for so long doesn't make it any more plausable. I'm saying it is a perposterous idea. When a thing does not make sense... even in its own reality. It ceases to be scary and becomes laughable. Sharknado is insanely stupid because its basic principle is absolutely inplausable.

Slow, dead zombies are the same for me (not quite to the degree of sharknado though). They don't make sense. I cannot suspend my disbelief and therefore they are not scary. This becomes more and more ingrained as the show goes on and the zombies are everywhere NOT rotting away and no explination as to why they are not.

You can say its some magic alternate reality where poeple don't rot away (even though that is what the people in the show expect) and that dead tissue can metabolize but at the end the day its just lazy writing. The drama part is solid as well as the psychological aspect. the music is amazing. i just wish all the zombies weren't there anymore.

[Loki]

I have to agree. Fast moving "Infected" like those from 28 Days Later are far more believable then traditional Zombies in large part because they die off eventually from starvation.

[ferox]

If you don't get the concept of science fiction in horror, you're just not going to get it. There's a block there, and if it's going to be there it is going to be there.

And it was an honest question. If I was being sarcastic I would say "Oh I see you totally understand how fiction works." You seem to be missing very key concepts in horror, which is why I was honestly wondering if you just didn't know much about horror outside of HHN.

[JDW]

I'm not missing anything. In order for there to be science fiction in the horror there actually has to be some science in the fiction. I'm not arguing with you either about what is and isn't scary and/or believable.

There is nothing believable about dead zombies. Never was in my mind never will be. Doesn't make me have a block because I find them boring.

I don't even care about this discussion anymore. People will do what they do and believe what they believe.

You want to believe they are plausible and interesting go right ahead.

[ferox]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_fiction

Science fiction is largely based on writing rationally about alternative possible worlds or futures.[2] It is similar to, but differs from fantasy in that, within the context of the story, its imaginary elements are largely possible within scientifically established or scientifically postulated laws of nature (though some elements in a story might still be pure imaginative speculation).

The settings for science fiction are often contrary to consensus reality, but most science fiction relies on a considerable degree of suspension of disbelief, which is facilitated in the reader's mind by potential scientific explanations or solutions to various fictional elements. Science fiction elements include:

---

If you don't like science fiction in horror that's a matter of taste, but you should know the definition of the genre.

Yes, it's not believable. If that's a problem for you, that's because the genre simply isn't for you.

Edited August 7, 2013 by ferox