Grindhousehero13 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Oh Hey Didn't See You There...... It's Your old buddy Grindhousehero13, we sure do have a lot of fun here on Horror Night Nightmares but I wanna take things serious for a bit and talk about something that for obvious reasons is very close to our hearts "Halloween Horror Nights". More specifically something that has it own following not just for us Hollywood goers but also at our sister event in Orlando. Now that I got that out of the way I'm gonna be serious as to give my little pseudo-article I'm about to write some weight so I want to make things clear before I begin. First we here at HNN try to respect all our members, in the eyes of the chainsaw we are all equal in the fog. If someone feels a certain way about something we should respect the way they feel. Next HHN is just another form of entertainment though one we love dearly, it's an escape and a way for us horror fans to live as the heroes of our favorite horror property but it is just that entertainment just like movies, TV shows, and video games, it's an art form in it's own right everything from the mazes to scarezones and even the shows. Now we get to my point the shows; now first I'm going to give you guys a brief history of shows at HHN then I will go into my opinions (Disclaimer: for the most part the opinions are mine and mine alone and do not represent Horror Night Nightmares or The Owner and Staff. This does not represent me as a moderator of these forums but as a die hard Halloween Horror Nights fan.) Okay here we go..... Halloween Horror Nights has become one of the premier Halloween event's in beautiful Southern California, an industry that was ruled by the likes of Knott's Berry Farm. Now since this is not meant to be a history lesson on HHN I will focus more on Hollywood and drain out most of the Orlando facts unless I believe it is necessary. Halloween Horror Night's first premiered in Hollywood in 1986 with it's Halloween based "Terror Tram". It did not return until 1992 with two mazes and a wide variety of shows including acts by Penn and Teller and "Chucky's In Your Face Insults" what would later become Chucky's Insult Emporium. Horror Nights would not show up again until 1997 before going into another hiatus, in this incarnation we saw four more mazes, and four shows including Chucky's Insult Emporium, Carnival Of Carnage, Beetlejuice's Graveyard Revue and the premier of a show we would come to know as Bill and Ted's Excellent Halloween Adventure. Based On the cult classic time traveling buddy flick from the 80's this show featured the film's rocker heroes and their time traveling phone booth as they skewered pop culture icons and movie characters from the year, packaged nicely in a predictable self aware format. Opening dance number, Bill & Ted arrive and great audience, a pop culture Villain shows up with a diabolical scheme, heroes arrive to aid (and most of the time comically fail or succeed in an odd way) final battle, a strange occurrence saves the day, and what the show can only describe as "The part where we dance for no reason" a musical number set to the hit pop songs of the year, then a friendly reminder to be excellent to one another and a farewell and see you next year dudes. Once the final hiatus hit it would be six years before we would HHN, in 2006 Creative Director John Murdy would revive HHN and turn it into the event we have come and love today although with only two mazes at the time John would bring Scarezones into the mix along with an "Icon" a character by the name of "The Director" who was designed by Universal Orlando who at the time had been putting on Halloween Horror Nights at Universal Orlando Resort for the past 16 years non stop. That year HHN Hollywood presented five shows,The return of Carnival of Carnage, and Chucky's Insult Emporium, and three new shows; Slaughter World, an adult version of the Water World stunt show, The Mutaytor a live electronic dance show and Fear Factor: Dead Celebrity Edition feature borrowed character; clowns Heckles and Twitch which was not well received. For unknown reasons despite being a part of of Orlando's line up annually Bill and Ted would not return until 2007 where it would become a fan favorite until 2013. In that year the shows was up to lackluster standards but one particular joke ended the show's run prematurely. The joke in question revolved around the spoof of Superman based on the 2013 "Man Of Steel" film. In the show's plot Superman was hit with fairy dust and turned into a homosexual stereotype version of the character. Not untypical of Bill and Ted's humor such jokes have been used before and is usually taken light heartily satirical making fun of the stereotype and not who the stereotype were made about, most of the time they will even spoof and throw under the bus certain racist and homophobic parties such as poking fun at the anti-Semitic remarks made by Mel Gibson, and the anti-immigration laws set by Arizona even going as far as calling fast food restaurant chain Chik-fill-a "A place of intolerance and hate" due to their anti-gay views. Now what was different about this joke? the portrayal of this "Gay Superman" was presented as being "Creepy" making the other characters uncomfortable, as well as weak and useless where it was stated to the point where he was told to "Man up" and was injected with steroids to be able to actually help defeat a villain. As well as some other bad and or tasteless writing the show was not up to par as other shows but it was not until a Vice article called attention to it that the show was pulled for the rest of HHN's run and was retired as of this year, thus saying goodbye to HHNH's last show. A quick history now here is me speaking as a fan. I enjoyed Bill and Ted since 2007 some years more than others but despite it not being horror centered is was always a nice comic relief addition to my time at HHN. After running and screaming all night it was an awesome way to sit down and enjoy a few laughs and though it may not be your cup of tea there is no denying that it was a fan favorite. Almost a year later I must say though it just sad that they decided to retire Bill and Ted honestly it shows a lack of tact on Universal's part. I have to make things clear though this is not the fault of John Murdy who is not in charge of shows, the cast and crew of Bill & Ted's Excellent Halloween Adventure, the rights holders, nor Universal Studios management it lays on the show's writers and producers for allowing a truly tasteless joke to slip through. Though I must say do blame with Universal for the action taken. In a metaphorical sense it's like getting a splinter and severing the whole arm instead of simpling plucking the splinter out of the finger. Honestly if was me I would of changed the script which the show has done more then once a year including that year, either not turn Superman gay and just portray him as weak if you really wanted to keep the A-Rod steroid joke, or if you wanna turn him gay like in past have him actually kick ass as a gay character as in the past with the gay superman character, Or take out that joke entirely but honestly I can understand ending the run for 2013 it was a sinking ship that year anyways it was better to cut it's losses and to apologize as the park itself is LGBT friendly and did not want bad publicity, but why put the nail into the coffin was it that hard to take an extra month or pay a guy one day to screen the script before it goes into rehearsals? Now personally I did not find that joke funny, I found it in bad taste even for a show that prides itself on being offensive, the only other time I felt this way when they joked about Heath Leadger's death back in 2008 which I might was taken out without canceling the show. I know a few gay people who were not offended by the joke but I understand why there are people who were. This does not represent the show's usual edgy humor which would normally skewer a stereotype for example Captain Mexico in 2011, rather than use a stereotype to skewer people. Is It a big deal to me? no I am not gay so I can't relate and I grew up in southern California a place where Homophobia rarely exist in the present day but I do understand it is something offensive and homophobia is still a big deal. Just because you have not encounter something does not mean it does no exist, and people's feelings should always be taken into consideration. We are all the same horror fans despite our sexual preference, race, or religious beliefs. So the reason I wrote this is in hopes this hits everyone who loves HHN as much as I do. Don't get me wrong it breaks my heart that we are not getting Bill & Ted and without even a replacement, but I love John Murdy's work and respect him for all he does for us die hard fans and casual fans alike plus I do believe this is one of the best HHN line ups ever, and what it is really about is the mazes. That being said Bill & Ted's Excellent Halloween Adventure is a staple of HHN, and a big part of what I look forward to every year. It honestly made me sad to see some fellow fans place blame on the gay community and attack them on social media for something that was not their faults. So from one fan to an other don't condemn people for being offended . Although I personally do not agree with a lot that Vice says in general I'm not going to verbally attack or complain about others for it, and I do agree that the joke itself was a huge fail on the writers part. I write this now as tensions have calmed so that maybe in some miracle we can eventually see Bill and Ted return triumphantly and better then ever. I am a firm believer in freedom of speech and parody but everything has a line that should not be crossed even for things that are edgy us as horror fans understand that in some cases crossing the line is fun but when someone is actually hurt or offended it is always too far. Now if you have thoughts feel free to share them but promise me one thing guys lets move forward if you want the show back let talk about the show coming back lets be positive and like our favorite heroes remind us lets be excellent to one another and party on dudes!!! So I have said my piece so to my fellow Members I wish you all happy haunts and I can't wait to once again see you all in the fog. Sincerely, GrindhouseHero13 surviving Horror Nights since 2006 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horror lover Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 (edited) This was a beautiful essay, Grind... I honestly believe that we will see our Stallyns return next year and this was just a small hiccup to test the memories of the crowds and the viability and popularity of the show.. Edited August 20, 2014 by horror lover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTH316 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 (edited) Very well written. My friends (including my gay friends) are extremely upset it is not coming back. Where else can they see half naked men dancing around? This was literally 50% of the reason they came, and like how I talk about the mazes all year, all they would do is talk about what will show up in Bill and Ted. They never got to see the show last year and was saddened, but found hope that it may come this year. This is my plea... there is still time, Universal. You can use Orlando's script, or some variation of it. You can cast within the next 2 weeks. Rehearsals would be long and hard, but worth it. A set can be built in that mean time. It may not be ready for opening weekend, but it could be done by October. You cancelled it half way through last year, so how about reviving it half way through this year. You could be the hero.... of Halloween! Edited August 20, 2014 by DTH316 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horror lover Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Very well written. My friends (including my gay friends) are extremely upset it is not coming back. Where else can they see half naked men dancing around? This was literally 50% of the reason they came, and like how I talk about the mazes all year, all they would do is talk about what will show up in Bill and Ted. They never got to see the show last year and was saddened, but found hope that it may come this year. This is my plea... there is still time, Universal. You can use Orlando's script, or some variation of it. You can cast within the next 2 weeks. Rehearsals would be long and hard, but worth it. A set can be built in that mean time. It may not be ready for opening weekend, but it could be done by October. You cancelled it half way through last year, so how about reviving it half way through this year. You could be the hero.... of Halloween! We should write to HHN on Twitter and FB non-stop until they give in.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted August 20, 2014 Author Share Posted August 20, 2014 thanks everyone! I honestly feel what set us back a bit is how a lot of people on social media acted like a ignorant mob when it was pulled I for one even got angry at the guy who wrote the article, I have problems with Vice in general sometimes. Unfortunately it made a lot of fans look like bigots especially to people who have no idea about HHN or Bill & Ted if you read a lot of the banter going on social media sites. I do feel at least us die hard fans can move past it and earn our show back. As Shaun said in Shaun of the dead "The only thing that will redeem mankind is cooperation." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horror lover Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 thanks everyone! I honestly feel what set us back a bit is how a lot of people on social media acted like a ignorant mob when it was pulled I for one even got angry at the guy who wrote the article, I have problems with Vice in general sometimes. Unfortunately it made a lot of fans look like bigots especially to people who have no idea about HHN or Bill & Ted if you read a lot of the banter going on social media sites. I do feel at least us die hard fans can move past it and earn our show back. As Shaun said in Shaun of the dead "The only thing that will redeem mankind is cooperation." Not to mention the HHN fans who sent death threats and cussed out the journalist on Twitter and Vice.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted August 20, 2014 Author Share Posted August 20, 2014 It is sad that these people represent us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horror lover Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 It is sad that these people represent us. Eh, I'm sure it felt very therapeutic for them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splitsoul Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I just want to say that I actually followed the discussion that took place here about the cancellation last year as a lurker, before I became an official member, and I like how the attitude towards the matter has developed over time. I think it's good that you're encouraging everyone to look forward rather than argue about what's done and over with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Jeffula Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 There were years where i really liked the Bill and Ted Show and there were years where i wanted to walk out on the show (last year was one of them). Its gonna be weird without them. Im still P***ed about everything that happened last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsylumSB Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 (edited) Oh Hey Didn't See You There...... Grind, I thought your intro was brilliant! It was as if I could hear classical chamber music as a live action camera slowly pans the fireplace, then antique furnishings, up to a bottle a cognac, then to someone wearing a smoking jacket, sifting a brandy glass, and blowing bubbles with a toy pipe. Hee Hee! It is good to see that people can still be sentimental while balancing logic. To a lesser degree, I feel the same way towards the end of House of Horrors and Jaws: The Ride. I finally get to visit Orlando this year and Jaws is now closed. Boo! But what I learned is that change is inevitable. Fortunately, you can feel both sentiment and acceptance towards things that change. Balance is healthy. However, I do not think the door has permenantly closed on Bill and Ted. At the same time, I am willing to be open to other entertainment. Edited August 20, 2014 by AsylumSB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunnylvr Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Grind, you wrote a truly wonderful piece here. I will admit, I was sort of holding my breath until I figured out where you were going. As a lesbian, I was very, very aware of what happened with B&T last year. I read all the stories, read too many comments, and I kept thinking - shit, another reason for people to take it out on the "over-sensitive" gay folk.. However, I was pleasantly surprised that I never really saw a huge wave of hate. In fact, much of what I read was similar to what you just wrote. I will say that I think it's ridiculous that B&T isn't coming back for you this year. I can see them just dumping it last year after the fiasco - it was probably more than they wanted to deal with. However, I don't understand why they would not bring it back for this year. Fire the guy who wrote the tasteless part of the script that created this mess, and find someone else who is actually funny to write something new. While we do attend B&T in Orlando one time during the season, and I do enjoy parts of it, I have to say I haven't been really impressed with it the last few years. It seems to rely WAY too much on juvenile humor. While I understand that's part of the appeal, and I can laugh at a fart joke as though I were a 14 year old boy, I also expect a smarter, wittier bit for those of us with more life experience. Just because I'm over 40 doesn't mean I don't understand or know pop culture. The humor doesn't all have to be so silly. They are professional writers, for chrissakes.. don't be so lazy. <end of rant> Anyway, thank you for being a kind and gentle soul. I'm glad I don't have to be nervous about being a part of this community. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferox Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I read all the stories, read too many comments, and I kept thinking - shit, another reason for people to take it out on the "over-sensitive" gay folk.. However, I was pleasantly surprised that I never really saw a huge wave of hate. In fact, much of what I read was similar to what you just wrote. You must have not seen the threads I was a part of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunnylvr Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 You must have not seen the threads I was a part of. Well, I saw some.. then I stopped reading. I know it's out there which is why I was holding my breath at first when I started reading this little letter.. wasn't sure which way it was going. You never know. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchet Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I look at it this way, I don't know how much money goes into Bill and Ted and how much it costs to pay the actors to run it nightly but with it now gone if that was the reason we got a 7th maze I'm (even if that 7th maze is Dracula) I am not upset in the least that its not coming back. Also I haven't been going to HHN since 06' like you Grind so I don't have a sentimental attachment to Bill and Ted like you do but I could understand and respect where your coming from. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlas Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 The tone of this post and the message of progression and acceptance is much appreciated. Now I'd rather not cartwheel through this shit storm of an issue especially after reading the Bill and Ted cancellation discussion last year but I'd just like to clarify a few things. Mostly in reference to one of the replies above. Saying that you have a gay friend who likes the show does not validate the crass writing. A few gay persons (especially young ones) do not represent the thoughts and lifestyles of the entire community. And there are plenty of places in LA/OC where you can watch half naked men dance around. I could provide a detailed list for you if you'd like The difference is, at those places, you probably won't be referred to as weak or gross.That said, gays are more than their sexual preference. Many of them come to HHN for reasons other than watching a few minutes of bare chests from a distance. Also, homophobia is alive and well. Southern California is no exception. What is a splinter for you, could be a machete for someone else. Anyway, to end this on a high note, I'm glad that you can understand what went wrong last year and why this is so important to the LGBT community. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTH316 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Yeah. Bring back Bill and Ted for my 3 gay friends. That's exactly what I was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlas Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Oh, that's nice. But that isn't what I was saying either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted August 20, 2014 Author Share Posted August 20, 2014 Grind, I thought your intro was brilliant! It was as if I could hear classical chamber music as a live action camera slowly pans the fireplace, then antique furnishings, up to a bottle a cognac, then to someone wearing a smoking jacket, sifting a brandy glass, and blowing bubbles with a toy pipe. Hee Hee! But what I learned is that change is inevitable. Fortunately, you can feel both sentiment and acceptance towards things that change. Balance is healthy. However, I do not think the door has permenantly closed on Bill and Ted. At the same time, I am willing to be open to other entertainment. thank you that's exactly what I was going for lol. Anyways I do understand change is a welcomed thing in my book, and like you I don't the door has closed prematurely on B&T but I do believe if it does not return next it is the end of line for the show I just hope someone from Universal stumbles across this. I don't think the budget from Bill & Ted has anything to do with the 7th maze that probably has more to do with AMC and the sold out nights from last year. That being said thank you for appreciating some of our connection to the show and I like I said earlier I can respect that it is not everyone's cup of tea. thank you. I do understand it is alive and well, but growing up here in a suburb of LA, I never really seen it happen, I known a lot of gay and lesbian people over my life time and parents always raised me to respect everyone unless they give you a reason not to but I digress my only experience with it is seeing it on the news or hearing a story of someone having problems with their families over being gay or just being a dumb 11 year old calling everything and everyone gay. So I don't see a lot of it from where I have been but I am aware it exist still. By all means the splinter reference was the joke itself and the arm was the show I was just saying how the joke could of been removed early before it became a fiasco as did. I do understand though that it of stuck out more to somebody else. Even me I compaired to Captain mexico not offending me cuz Im mexican, but I remembered back and they joked about the stereotype and not the person it represented like this joke did in 2013. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 So I was going through Instagram mostly to try and find something related to Orlando's show (ironically it's the best one they had in a while) and I'm seeing a lot people missing the show and in an odd turn of events I would say that about %80 of them have no idea what happened last year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 So I was going through Instagram mostly to try and find something related to Orlando's show (ironically it's the best one they had in a while) and I'm seeing a lot people missing the show and in an odd turn of events I would say that about %80 of them have no idea what happened last year. I am pretty sure it will be back next year. I think they ditched the Wyld Stalyons this year juat to let the mess from last year fade. Let's not forget the terrible lines from opening weekend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 It's good to see that people are not going in circle though maybe it's a bright light of hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringwraith Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I heard the two main creators of the show actually moved to different states and that's the main reason it didn't go on this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grindhousehero13 Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 I heard the two main creators of the show actually moved to different states and that's the main reason it didn't go on this year. really? that's odd can you elaborate a little more? Someone also said that the reason it was gone was because of the congestion it would of caused from the construction for Springfield I just assumed the incident from last year was the reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horror lover Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Okay this is all getting weird now... the writer and director are no longer with Universal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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